[antir-heralds] Conflict check, Barry argent and vert, a grenade gules within a bordure sable

[Jillian Bower]

Hi :)

Okay, so the "grenade" charge is wicked cool! Let's see what precedents have to say about what a grenade conflicts with:

1. [a fireball Or vs. a grenade Or, enflamed proper] There is no difference for changing less than half the tincture of the primary charge from mostly Or to entirely Or. There is no difference between a grenade and a fireball... [Jehanne le feu du Christ, 06/02, R-Atenveldt] 

2. The SCA distinguishes the single-flamed grenade from the quadruply-flamed fireball in blazon. [Constanza de Sevilla, 08/03, A-Middle]

So, we have to check against other grenades and fireballs. Given the number of other precedents about roundels conflicting with things that look the same (moon in her plentitude, astrolabe, clock face), even though I can't find a precedent specifically relating grenades to roundels, I'm going to check it against roundels too, just to be safe. 

Proposed device: Barry argent and vert, a grenade gules within a bordure sable

First, Ordinary category "Grenade" (whose entry says "see also 'Roundel - Whole' and 'Fire', yipee!):

* Sun, Principality of the (May of 1992 via Atenveldt):
Argent, a fireball proper within a bordure azure

CD1: Changing the division of the field from "argent" to "barry argent and vert" by RfS X.4.a
CD2: Changing the tincture of the bordure from "azure" to "sable" by RfS X.4.d

Next, Ordinary category "Roundel - Whole - 1 - Charged - Gules". Nothing close. Then I went to "Bordure - Uncharged - Plain line - Sable - Surrounding 1 only":

* Ruarc Stot (July 1985 via the Middle):
Barry vert and argent, a horse rampant within a bordure sable

Because this device and the proposed device only have two types of charges on the field, they qualify for RfS X.2. Since the primary charge is significantly different between them, X.2 clears the proposed device from this device.

I believe this device is clear. Someone else may find something I didn't though! :)

--
In joyful service to the Summits and An Tir,
Lady Áine Steele
Löwenmähne Herald

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Wenyeva atte Grene <litlnemo at slumberland.seattle.wa.us>
> Hi all,
> 
> As a name herald my armory conflict checking skills are weak at best. 
> I was asked to provide some feedback on a device design by my own 
> charming spouse (who normally views SCA stuff with some disdain, but, 
> hey, I'm working on assimilating him!). For some reason he sat up 
> late tonight designing devices. Of his own volition. Yes, I am 
> shocked. :)
> 
> His design ideas are at http://redbomb.com/heraldry/showall.html . 
> Yes, he's aware there is a color-on-color violation included on the 
> page. But the device he most wants to conflict check is at the bottom 
> of the page:
> 
> Barry argent and vert, a grenade gules within a bordure sable. (Do 
> the flames as pictured here have to be explicitly blazoned? "enflamed 
> proper"?)
> 
> If there is a problem with that, he also likes:
> Per pale vert and argent, a grenade gules within a bordure sable
> and
> Quarterly argent and vert, a grenade gules within a bordure sable.
> Both of these are on the page as well.
> 
> I did a quick search and thought that the devices were clear, but I 
> am not good at it, and I am sure I must be missing something, so if 
> anyone can enlighten us, that would be wonderful and I would be very 
> grateful.
> 
> (These would tie in nicely with my device, which also includes vert 
> and argent, and fire.)
> 
> Thanks!
> W
> 
> -- 
> \-\ Wenyeva atte grene * "In tenebris lux"
>   \-\ Armorum Servula, quam Ancoram Caeruleam dicunt
>    \-\ Per chevron argent and vert, three beacons counterchanged.
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