[antir-heralds] CC: Per pale argent and azure...

[Dafydd Caerfyrddin]

So, it appears to be clear?  Correct?

Thank you all for your help!!

Dafydd

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <chrisact at qwickconnect.net>
To: "Heralds" <antir-heralds at antir.sca.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 6:22 PM
Subject: Re: [antir-heralds] CC: Per pale argent and azure...


> Dafydd Caerfyrddin wrote:
>> My client would like the following :
>>
>> Per pale argent and azure, an oak tree proper and on a chief sable three 
>> bears sejant erect to sinister argent.
>>
>>
>>
>> I found the following possible conflicts:
>>
>>
>>
>>   a.. Canice Scrupe
>>     a.. The following device associated with this name was registered in 
>> January of 1996 (via Atlantia):
>>     Azure, two dolphins urinant respectant and on a chief argent three 
>> bears rampant gules.
>> I believe this is clear...one CD for changing the primary tincture, one 
>> CD for changing the primary charge, one CD for the different 
>> posture/tincture of the bears, etc.
>>
>>   a.. Charles of the Red Oakes
>>     a.. The following badge associated with this name was registered in 
>> March of 1984 (via Atlantia):
>>     Per pale sable and argent, an oak tree eradicated and blasted gules.
>> Again, I believe this to be clear...one CD for changing the tincture, not 
>> sure if there is a CD for the difference between a tree blasted and 
>> eradicated and a tree proper?, and one ce for the chief and secondary 
>> charges.
>>
>>   a.. Duncan MacGregor of Gleann Abhann
>>     a.. The following device associated with this name was registered in 
>> January of 2006 (via Gleann Abhann):
>>     Or, in fess a brown bear sejant erect to sinister and an oak tree 
>> eradicated fructed proper, a point pointed vert.
>> I need some help on this one, let me see if I can get it right...one CD 
>> for the change of tincture, one CD for the chief, one CD for each of the 
>> charges being different?
>>
>> Any comments or critiques would be greatly appreciated!!
>>
>> YIS,
>>
>> THL Dafydd Caerfyrddin
>>
>
> I find no conflicting device. :-)
>
> BTW, although Ursula is correct, and the proposed device qualifies under
> X.2, I found it simpler to check against "oak trees proper"* and then
> against chiefs sable.
>
> A few moments' thought will make clear that any existent device that
> conflicts with the proposal must show up under either the primary charge
> group (the oak) or the secondary (the chief), in this case at least
> (because there's only one of each). There is no way to avoid it. Thus,
> two checks are enough. Also, this means there's no need to go looking
> for the tertiary charge group (the bears). Also note that this is two
> checks, rather than the nine for checking each tincture.
>
> *NB: While looking for oak trees, the Ordinary redirected me to "Tree -
> Rounded Shape" which, in turn, did not have a sub-division for Proper,
> leading me to Vert.
>
>
> OOPS! OK, late thought: there *could* be a conflict with an existent
> device with more than one "Tree - Rounded Shape". However, it would have
> to have the same field, since there's one CD for changing the number in
> the primary charge group. That is easy enough to check, and I just did.
> So, I had to make *3* checks. However, the same check would have to be
> made if you were looking through all the "Tree - Rounded Shape" 's. So
> it's still simpler. ;-)
>
> Please, don't misunderstand me; I'm not trying to dictate "the one
> correct way" to conflict check. I'm just explaining how I did it, in the
> hopes others will find something useful. Use whatever you find works,
> and you are comfortable with, and take what I say with a grain of salt. 
> :-)
>
> In service (I deeply hope),
> ~~Basil Dragonstrike
>
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